53 replies to this topic

[myconid]

zoot, on 01 September 2012 - 05:07 PM, said:

I wonder if we couldn't actually in the art license require distributors to state something like "This product can be freely downloaded from www.wildfiregames.com" in any 'sales presentations' they give. GPL won't let you add such clauses for the code/binaries, but CC-BY-SA will.

And a note on the main menu saying "If you paid money for this game, you got scammed. Get the updated version for free at www.wildfiregames.com".

[zoot]

fabio, on 01 September 2012 - 06:09 PM, said:

While the source code is GPL you can restrict the use of the binaries. Red Hat make a lot of $$$ selling their software, others (Centos) can recompile the source but you cannot redistribute the binaries.

Sure you can (redistribute the binaries). You just can't use the Red Hat trademark (which is why CentOS always uses shady references like 'a prominent North American Enterprise Linux vendor').

Quote

But anyway I'll not add this legal restriction, it may scary someone that want to provide it for free (e.g. on a DVD on a magazine) and if someone want to cheat it can remove it anyway. What you can do is add a note in the installer or in the main menu screen (a button with a page with it and also other useful informations).

That would just be silly when perfect legal options exist to prevent the fraudulent sale from ever happening in the first place.

myconid, on 01 September 2012 - 06:10 PM, said:

And a note on the main menu saying "If you paid money for this game, you got scammed. Get the updated version for free at www.wildfiregames.com".

Indeed

[fabio]

And anyway buying a CD for a few € may be useful to many that don't have a fast Internet connection and can also publicize 0 A.D. to who don't know it.

[zoot]

fabio, on 01 September 2012 - 06:19 PM, said:

And anyway buying a CD for a few € may be useful to many that don't have a fast Internet connection and can also publicize 0 A.D. to who don't know it.

Yeah, definitely no need to prevent people from doing that, IMO.

[feneur]

zoot, on 01 September 2012 - 06:25 PM, said:

Yeah, definitely no need to prevent people from doing that, IMO.

Most definitely not. However, it's important to give people a chance to experience 0 A.D. as good as it can be and not just as it was at some specific point in time before it is finished (+ it's sad if the 0 A.D. brand is connected to unprofessional behavior/unfinished software)

[BrynnOfCastlegate]

Lion.Kanzen, on 01 September 2012 - 08:52 AM, said:

its a noob, i don't think he can create decent CD art

Would you like some decent CD art?

--Brynn

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[zoot]

BrynnOfCastlegate, on 01 September 2012 - 08:45 PM, said:

Would you like some decent CD art?

Nice

[BrynnOfCastlegate]

zoot, on 01 September 2012 - 08:49 PM, said:

Nice

Thank you!

--Brynn

[Pureon]

The ebay product description lists units on ships/structures, ship ramming/capturing, and catapults on deck - none of which are true, meaning buyers have a good case for contacting the UK Trading Standards Institute. Just saying.

[zoot]

Also, he may already be in violation of the CC-BY-SA 3.0, because it states:

"... by exercising Your rights under this License, You may not implicitly or explicitly assert or imply any connection with, sponsorship or endorsement by the Original Author, Licensor and/or Attribution Parties, as appropriate, of You or Your use of the Work, without the separate, express prior written permission of the Original Author, Licensor and/or Attribution Parties."

and:

"... if You Reproduce, Distribute or Publicly Perform the Work either by itself or as part of any Adaptations or Collections, You must not distort, mutilate, modify or take other derogatory action in relation to the Work which would be prejudicial to the Original Author's honor or reputation."

Of course, only a judge would be able to make the final decision as to whether either of those terms have actually been violated.

[Geek377]

Okay time to report this idiot... I'm sorry I just don't like his whole scam operation going on. Yes he is technically allowed to sell 0 AD and scam people. But what about the other items? And besides, its just morally wrong. Just the kind of thing to make a dent in the OS movement. Just plain disgusting.

Oh, and I agree that we should restrict the selling of third party binaries...

myconid, on 01 September 2012 - 06:10 PM, said:

And a note on the main menu saying "If you paid money for this game, you got scammed. Get the updated version for free at www.wildfiregames.com".

This could be bypassed by editing the files.

[zoot]

Geek377, on 01 September 2012 - 11:34 PM, said:

Oh, and I agree that we should restrict the selling of third party binaries...

Such restrictions are against the GPL (and unnecessary).

[Geek377]

zoot, on 01 September 2012 - 11:47 PM, said:

Such restrictions are against the GPL (and unnecessary).

By restrict I meant not via license per se but just by asking them to take it down. Also once 0 A.D. is finished, I don't see any harm in having an official CD distribution store (the game gets distributed to people without fast Internet and its good publicity). Also having an official CD prevents people from being scammed into buying the incomplete game.

[majapahit]

Already discussed about this before, its better for the wfg team to cooperate with independent vendors by cooperating with them earlier.
Some profits goes to the vendors, some goes to support the game.

Anything can be monetized, the problem is how to manage it to support the spirit of fairness.

http://www.wildfireg...showtopic=15256

Edited by majapahit, 03 September 2012 - 03:24 AM.

[majapahit]

BrynnOfCastlegate, on 01 September 2012 - 08:45 PM, said:

Would you like some decent CD art?

--Brynn

Nicely done cd art, put it on the 0 A.D. art subforum

[zoot]

zoot, on 01 September 2012 - 05:07 PM, said:

I wonder if we couldn't actually in the art license require distributors to state something like "This product can be freely downloaded from www.wildfiregames.com" in any 'sales presentations' they give. GPL won't let you add such clauses for the code/binaries, but CC-BY-SA will.

I've taken this idea up on the debian-legal mailing list. In short, to be included in major Linux distributions like Debian, our software (including art) needs to grant users a certain amount of freedom to do with it what they want. The people on debian-legal couldn't come up with a really compelling reason that a clause like the above would be too restrictive, but they weren't positive about it either. This leads me to believe that adding such a restriction on the off-chance that we might bust a petty eBay vendor or two with it probably isn't worth the trouble.

Instead they suggested we add a copyright notice in-game (we don't seem to have one currently), because the GPL forbids redistributors from removing them (CC-BY-SA seems to have a similar requirement). This should make it easier for buyers to discover whether they've 'been had' so they can downrate the seller on eBay etc.

[historic_bruno]

Sounds good! "© 200?-2012 Wildfire Games - Download for free at wildfiregames.com"

[zoot]

historic_bruno, on 04 September 2012 - 04:45 PM, said:

Sounds good! "© 200?-2012 Wildfire Games - Download for free at wildfiregames.com"

That's what I would try too, lol But from what I gather, they can probably get away with removing the latter part so it would become just, say: "© 200?-2012 Wildfire Games - Buy cheap at ivanscheapgames.ru" But still better than nothing, I suppose.

[Jeru]

+1

[historic_bruno]

zoot, on 04 September 2012 - 05:00 PM, said:

That's what I would try too, lol But from what I gather, they can probably get away with removing the latter part so it would become just, say: "© 200?-2012 Wildfire Games - Buy cheap at ivanscheapgames.ru" But still better than nothing, I suppose.

They could but they'd have to figure out which file to modify and then repackage it, judging by the quality of those eBay listings I think they would struggle with that They are probably limited to copy-pasting outdated info from our website and burning the EXE installer to a CD.